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Old 02-20-2012, 11:58 PM   #1
encantotom
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Default 2002 tag axle airbags

seems that my tag bags needed replacing. they has some deep cracks that were not visible the first time we looked at them.

here is the hard part. what bag are they? i got the tag suspension part number from newell and then called ridewell. they said it was a discontinued suspension.
ridewell part # 2840002 tag suspension dana axle

ridewell said it supplied the suspension and newell supplied the airbags.


called boyd back and he gave me the airbag number.



he gave me.

The Ridewell part number is 1003589378C.

The Firestone part number is W01-358-9378.

This is a Firestone 1T15L-2 bellows

i exchanged messages with someone else with an 02. they gave me the same airbag part number from their receipt but said there was some issue that the mounts were 90 degrees off.

no one has any of those bags. so before i ordered them to have them made by firestone i thought i would try to look again. the bag that newell gave me has the top and bottom bolts rotated 90 degrees from each other. but.....my airbag has the top and bottom bolts in line with each other.

so i had my bus guy take one airbag off today. it is a firestone
W01-358-8908. no one has any of them either.

i called firestone and they said it was a valid part number but they dont have any either. 8 weeks to make them.

they are exactly the same bags except one has the bolts rotated 90 deg. ends up you can with considerable effort take the bottom bolt out of the bag and rotate the bottom to align up the bolts. so that is what they must have done at newell.

anyway, i am going to order the right ones and make it easy.

thought you might enjoy my adventure

tom
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Old 02-26-2012, 11:39 PM   #2
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Tom,

I just blew a tag axle bag on the way to Daytona in SC on Wednesday. I have a 2003 #655. I had the exact problem. I had Newell air ship one to me, but it was wrong. Firestone #9448 or 9445 will work. The studs are oposite from top to bottom mounts. I found a guy in Michigan that sorted things out for me, then found the bag locally. If your bags look bad, I suggest you change them. I blocked the line on my blown bag and still couldn't move the coach as it was to heavy for the drive axle to handle. We had to change it out right where it blew out. I hope this helps. I ordered one for each axle to carry along from now on.

Dave
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Old 02-27-2012, 02:04 AM   #3
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Good advice! Anyone know the number for an '82? Newell doesn't have records for these coaches that before#1
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Old 02-27-2012, 07:09 AM   #4
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Dave. Thanks. The bag you used is not exactly the same but is very close. I got a quote of 7 weeks to get the exact one. I have a spare for the drive. What bag is on your front?

It would be nice to know the differnces to make sure their is not a capacity difference. The one you used has the same belows and internal rubber stop. I will look more at it tonite.

Tom. In taxi in cold and smoggy shanghai.
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:02 AM   #5
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dave, the 9445 has the upper and lower bolts rotated 90 degrees. i called firestone last week and they said that you could loosen the bottom center bolt that holds the rubber bumper inside and rotate the bottom plate to align the top and bottom bolts but it is quite a hassle. my bus guy really groaned when i mentioned possibly doing that.

the 9448 looks very similar but has slightly different bolt lengths and a few others. i would guess that is the one you got and it must have worked.

tom
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Old 02-27-2012, 06:43 PM   #6
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I had a ride height valve fail once while driving, so I have an idea of what serious an air bag failure could be. A passing trucker alerted me before serious damage was done. So I see some folks replacing their air bags based on age or appearance and others that fail, and still others that are running on their original bags with no problems so far.
Making this much more difficult is the information that tends to indicate it is about impossible to know what bag works on your coach unless you remove the existing one to see what was installed. I am not too confident that records exist at Newell that will help me. My one attempt with them resulted in an email that said they did not have that information. The thought of having a failure and then having to wait a significant time to get the correct air bag is not comforting. Haveing a spare on board would make me feel a lot better.
So, all of this to just summarize what I have read and to ask if I have missed anything - like some easy way to determine what air bag I have in the three different applications on my coach. So, if it has to be removed to see what bag it is, just how hard is that to accomplish? I am sure it is no trick for Tom's bus guy with his lift and experience, but what about my chances of doing it as a DIY? Could it be accomplished by raising the coach on the bags and then blocking the body in the raised position? Then venting the air and taking things apart. With the tire and wheel still on I bet access would be miserable. All thoughts appreciated.
Thanks, Russ
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:39 PM   #7
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hi russ,

the first thing to do is to have a look at the airbag itself. my drive bags had the part number on the side of the bags (all 4 of them). that made it easy.

one of the 4 of my drive bags had been replaced as it had a date code that was only a couple of years old. i replaced all of them anyway and kept that bag as the spare.

it does appear to be hit and miss on the part number being on the bag itself. like i have said, my tag and front bags do not have them on it. it does appear that my front bags have been replaced as well but my tags do need replacing as you know from my adventures.

it does make me wonder why the bags on some seem to last almost forever and show no signs of cracking or wear and others do. my coach does have nearly 200k miles on it so maybe that is it. or where it has been etc.

when leo took off my tag bag he didnt use the lift. it was in use on another coach. he did lift up the back of the coach with air assisted hydraulic jacks and block it. he uses metal stands that they made to block it. then he took off the tag tire/wheel and then had total access to the bag. taking the bag itself off was then only a ten or fifteen minute thing.

but he did need to lift it a bit more with the jacks to get the bag out.

without taking the tire off would be a bit tougher.

the front bags have a lot better access to them.

it took him about 2 hours start to finish to change all 4 drive axle bags. using the lift and tall floor jackstands.

you can get pretty close to what bag it is if you get lucky or take some measurements.

on the tag and drive axles, on the late 90's and early 2000's the suspension appears to be made by ridewell. if so, they put a suspension model number metal plate on the the vertical riser plate that is welded to the frame of the coach on the drivers side in between the tag and drive wheels and if it is cleaned off it is visible to see just looking in between the two wheels. on mine the drive axle model number plate was there. if you call ridewell with that number they can tell you what bag was on that suspension. i called them and what they said matched the bag that was on mine.

you could see where the tag plate had been on mine and that it had fallen off. so if it is there, then you can perhaps call ridewell and or newell and find out what bag was supposed to be on it.

but.....before buying it, look at the mounting of the bag itself and the diagrams of the bag to make sure they match. that is what didnt match when i did that.

however, you can see the bolt mounting pattern on your bags fairly easily. that is where when i looked i saw that they were NOT rotated 90 degrees like the bag that i was told should be on there was.

but i could measure center to center on the bottom mounting bolts (i did with a caliper going center to center on the holes where the nuts go) and get pretty close.

i also did an estimate of the top mounting bolts.

then you can look in the catalog starting with the series we know it is part of. the W01-358-xxxx to find the similar ones.

also, since the airbags themselves have different components, with the firestones, some of them have the bellows number stamped below the firestone brand on the bag. that will help you narrow it also. but, on mine they didnt have that stamped on the bag.

the firestone airspring catalog goes through how to identify the bags and is quite helpful.

then, once you get the airbag off, hopefully the sticker isnt worn off.....

on the bag we took off to look at, part of the sticker was worn off, but fortunately not where the part number was....

the front axle on at least mine appears to be a newell design and they specified the airbag on it.

tom in shanghai
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Old 03-02-2012, 11:44 PM   #8
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dave, thanks for the great tip. i did the comparison and the w01-358-9448 is basically identical to the w01-358-8908 that is on my tag now. it is ever so slightly different but will work. i just ordered 2 of them. $311 shipped for two.

thanks again,

tom
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Old 03-03-2012, 02:40 AM   #9
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Congrats Tom on finally determining what bags you need. Glad you are home safe, and sorry you have to dash off again in a couple of days. Safe travels to you......we miss Mesa, AZ!
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