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Old 03-03-2008, 10:23 PM   #1
hlfdzn
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Default Lighting, Defrosters, Heat & switch...

Well as part of our preparation to head back to Alaska shortly and seeing as how the weather in N. VA was in the high 60's, I started climbing around the coach to explore.

First thing...checking out the front light situation, I discovered some loose wiring behind each side of the headlights that was coiled by color. My son and I both checked out the wires under the dash, but as of yet haven't located where they come out nor found them on the front schematic. They are a large gauge black with smaller gauge blue, red, and white with a small black line. I'm still looking at installing some auxilliary lighting as the easiest option. Key concern is still the mounting of a light bracket.

While we were under the dash, I started to check out for improving the defroster situation. I found out why some of the vents aren't putting out air, they are dummy vents...working exteriors, but closed off on the back. Go figure. Anyone at Newell that can tell me why you would ever put these in a coach? Still working on figuring out exactly what vents work under what settings on the fan controls. My dash also has an additional switch that is marked auxilliary defroster (or something like that). It seems to increase the air output.

Last week I finally read the directions on using the propane furnaces using the manuals on the link Michael provided (thanks Michael!) It helps when you correctly cycle the heaters. They both are working fine now. I'm still checking out putting a Proheat diesel coolant heater in. Troy T. did this recently and it sounds like it would be exceptionally beneficial to those of us who travel the northern climates in winter. I'd sure wish mine had the Aqua-hot...

Last question... do any of you have light switch in the rear bulkhead cabinet bottom over your bed? What does it operate? I've checked everything I can over the last year and still haven't found it.

Thanks in advance for letting me tap your knowledge.
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Old 03-04-2008, 01:06 AM   #2
Wally Arntzen
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Default Light Switches

I have switches on the side of the bed and one is for the ceiling in the bedroom and the other is for the floor lights whitch are in the bath, kitchen and below the dash for walking around at night. Check and see if the floor lights work, they may just need bulbs.
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Old 03-04-2008, 01:10 AM   #3
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Default Heaters

I forgot to tell you that I have slept in my coach at a Green Bay Packers game a couple of years at 20 below zero and took showers. The coach was warm as toast with the 3 LP furnaces and I always travel with full water tank which has never been a problem.
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Old 03-04-2008, 02:08 AM   #4
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Wally,

I've checked the floor lights, no such luck. The switch I'm referring to is on the bottom of the upper cabinets directly above the center head of the bed. BTW, my floor lights are red, kind of reminds me of the red flashlights we would use shipboard during blackend ship ops. Are yours red?

-20, I'm hoping that the temps we encounter heading back up will be slightly warmer, but not much. We had -30 last Feb heading down.

I'm interested in the different heating systems, you've 3 propane, but I've only 2. Mine are located under the forward couch and in the bedroom closet below the tv. I also have an electric heater in the bathroom and below the forward cabinet across from the couch. While running, I also have a heater under the bed that runs off of the engine coolant.
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Old 03-04-2008, 02:49 AM   #5
Wally Arntzen
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Default heaters

My coach is an 88 and 40' long. It has 3 LP gas heaters, front room, kitchen and bedroom/bath. Also 3 electric heaters, bottom of dash, bath and bedroom as well as on in the lower water compartment. Engine heaters at dash, bedroom and lower water compartment. The kitchen LP heater has a vent that goes to the lower water compartment. I have a temperature read in the water compartment that I read on the dash so I always know what the temp is in the water compartment. The engine heater in the water compartment always is adequeate when on the go and the electric heater is more that enough when pluged in or running the gererator. The main concern when using my coach in cold weather is that you have to be pluged in or have the generator running to keep the engine heater running or the engine will not start below 40 degrees due to the use of 40 weight oil with the 8V92 engines. You may have the series 60 which is different story. Good luck and just keep chipping away at the concerns your having, you have a great coach and you will learn to love it.
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Old 03-04-2008, 08:24 AM   #6
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Paul,

I also have some 'spare' wires behind the headlights but most were in use. My coach was wired at the original customers request to have all four headlights come on, both on low beam and on high beam. I have disconnected the low beams on the inner headlights because people kept flashing their lights at me thinking I had my high beams on. I left all four high beams connected. Since I don't have any wiring diagrams, I don't know where the extra wires originate BUT according to my manual Front Terminal Board connection 37 has a blue wire that feeds optional fog lights and the Chassis Fuse Panel next to it fuse 2 has a blue wire for the electric **** and a blue wire (optional) for fog lights.

As to the mounting of a light bracket, I have seen several Newell's with fog lights mounted below the generator on the front. That is the air exit duct from the generator radiator so you would want to avoid leaving any openings that were not sealed.

You are right about the defroster vents. There are more defroster vents than are connected. If all of them were connected, the air flow would be so low through each of them that it would not do much defrosting. The switch marked auxiliary defroster appears to turn on an additional blower under the dash. The main defroster blowers are the same as the heater blowers and are located in front of the generator fan in the right front compartment.

Here is what I have learned about the heater/defroster vents operation. In vent, whether set for heat or air, the switch on the HVAC control panel turns on the two outboard blowers in the compartment in front of the generator fan. The air will come out of typically two vents on the drivers side and two vents on the passengers side. On the drivers side one vent is typically on the console/dash and the other is near the floor by the drivers left foot. On the passengers side, the vents are on the console, one high and one low. When you push the defrost button on the HVAC control, a vacuum bulb under the dash activates a diverter louver that turns off the four heat/air conditioner vents and directs the flow to the vents in front of the windshield. I am not sure of the location of the auxilary defrost blower but it sounds like it is also under the dash and it certainly does supplement the air flow to the defrost vents.

Beside the HVAC controls you likely have a control marked Arm Vents. That runs a separate blower to provide air to the vent in the side console/arm rest on each side. As mentioned earlier, the other three blowers are all located behind the panel at the front of the passenger side front compartment where the auxiliary 120 volt air pump and the fan and motor for the generator are.

Glad your heaters are now working.

Interesting question about the switch over your head in the rear bulkhead cabinet. I have a switch plate in that location but no switch. Do you have a ceiling fan? I do but it works exclusively off the wireless remote control.

As in your coach, the switches for the aisle lights, bedroom lights and reading lights under the overhead cabinet are all located with the radio on the passenger side of the bed along with a panic switch for the alarm system and a switch for the inverter.

My aisle lights are not red. I suspect someone has either put red bulbs in them OR has put red covers over the bulbs. You can pry the aisle lights out of the cabinets and replace the bulbs with clear ones for additional light if you wish. I have three lights wired to that switch, one on the bed platform, one next to the toilet and one under the couch right behind the passengers seat. There is another switch for the aisle lights on the drivers console.

Lastly, my coach, like yours only has two LP furnaces but they will keep the coach warm in cold weather. These were special requests as the coaches typically came with Primus systems.
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Old 03-04-2008, 02:09 PM   #7
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Hello Michael,

I too saw the optional fog light wiring, which brings up another question. Where did Newell attach the fog lights? I've looked at the generator space for possible mounting locations but as you mentioned don't want to deal with having to move lights or wiring to pull out the gen unit. I'm now thinking of attaching something to the steel frames that the headlights are using. That would also localize all my lighting wiring to one area.

One other issue I have is that I've made a front rock guard out of PVC and hardware cloth to protect the front end on the Alaska travels. Rock damage is a way of life up there and it worked well on our round trip last year. I'll have to incorporate the aux lighting into that also.

My thoughts on the spare wires are that since the black wire was much larger, it's probably the power and the others might be the switch & ground wires all running to a local relay although with all the relays mounted inside on the board, I wasn't sure if Newell would do that.

Why did Newell install vents when they were not going to use them? It just seems like an unneded expense. I'd sure like to know the original thinking... Regardless, thank you for passing on your discoveries on the controls, I'm going to see what I come up with using them and will let you know.

No ceiling fan in our unit...probably a good thing with the limited headroom, otherwise I'd probably have some new notches in my head. I'm going to do some more electrical testing today to see what I can come up with.

The red aisle lights were ordered on my coach. We don't really use them much so won't mess with them, but I like the red as it doesn't ruin your night vision while you're running down the road yet allows others to move around and see where they are going. With our poor lighting situation, I need all my night vision I can get.

Wally, when you were dry camping in cold weather, did you find it necessary to keep the generator running all night long or just several hours before getting ready to start the engine? I'm concerned that the normal electrical requirements of the refer, lights, etc. coupled with the furnaces will necessitate the running of the generator just to get through the cold nights.
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Old 03-05-2008, 03:54 AM   #8
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hi,

i have replaced the floor lights. they are 12volts and in mine are license plate lights units you can buy at any autosupply store for 4-5 bucks. very easy and fast to do.

as for the heaters, i have a 38' and have 3 lp heaters and 4 electric heaters and the coolant ones in the bed and bay. the perfectoe heater that is under the couch worked fine but i contacted the manufacturer and they told me they had been recalled and were dangerous, but that the recall was over. they still make identical sized replacements so i bought one along with a newer better thermostat that i am going to install when i put the couches back in.

my coolant heater under the bed wasnt working and i found the ground wire totally not connected in the electrical bay directly underneat it. it was a wire about 5 feet long just coiled and zip tied up. i have no idea why it wasnt connected. i grounded it and it works fine now.

the other 3 heaters are from a company that is not in business. two of mine are flakey so i will look to find a suitable replacement. it is lower on my list to do.

my 3 lp furnaces are dometic and one works great and the other two are flakey. i found the manual and have yet to spend much time other than cleanng them. mine come on and try to start 3 times then just stop trying to fire. i am going to take out the good one, take it apart and totally clean it and then use it for parts to see what fixes the other two. i plan on making a hose that will go from a bbq propane tank and hook it up sitting on the driveway and troubleshoot it that way. i think it is most likely a themocouple, but might be the solenoid gas valve. they worked intermittantly then stopped.

my kitchen lp heater also has a vent that goes into the bathroom and the lower water tank bay. i like wallys idea of putting a temp gauge in the water bay to see what temp it is. i might do that as well. good idea.

tom
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Old 03-05-2008, 01:13 PM   #9
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Default Running generator in cold weather

When traveling in cold weather if I am not pluged in I run the generator all night long with the engine heater on as well. The 8v92 engines do not start in cold weather due to the heavy oil and its not wise to keep cranking to try make it happen. I'm from Minnesota and I use my coach all year long and cold weather has never been a reason not to take it out. On one occaision I ran my generator for 7 days 24 hours a day and that is not a problem. This occaision was in very hot weather and it was necessary to stay cool. The dash air on my coach will not cool the coach and I run two of the coach units while on the road and all three when Im parked depending on how hot it is.
Regarding the heating and air conditioning units, I replaced all of my electric units and had all of my furnaces serviced and there is nothing in my coach that does not work. I'm kind of a fanatic about having everything doing what it is supposed to do.
Good luck and just keep chipping away and you will learn to love your newell.
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Old 03-05-2008, 09:34 PM   #10
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Well, the switch part of the question has been resolved. It has 12v power, but doesn't go to anything anymore. I think it probably used to control both of the halogen lights over the head of the bed, but someone previously opted to install individual toggle switches so each side can control their own light.

I forgot to pass on that when I spoke with the factory, I asked why they installed the dummy defroster vents. They said it was pure astetics.

Great info Tom. I sure would like to see the pictures of all the work you're doing.

Wally, I will keep chipping away, but already love the Newell. I was hoping to cut back on the generator some, but will plan on running it when boondocked. I have the 17.5 kw unit but haven't been able to pin down the gph usage. Has anyone else? Where in MN are you? My family is in the MSP and Cambridge area. On our travels through there, I'm hoping to get in contact with Troy T. maybe we can all meet?

Still working on the lighting...
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Old 03-06-2008, 05:25 AM   #11
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Hi Paul,

I live in Andover which is about 15 miles from Cambridge. I'm in Arizona now but will be back in Minnesota the middle of April. I have to stop in at Newell for some Windshields on the home. I would like to visit if you get to Minnesota so give me a shout when you get there.
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Old 03-08-2008, 12:48 PM   #12
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My latest thought is to mount a flat verticle brackets on the 1" tubes that the lights are mounted to just inside the high beams that would stick out front about 3' inches and would support a swing away light bracket. This would allow extra llghting to be installed and also the opening of the generator space. Wiring would come through the pivot side of the bracket. I'm not sure how this would look though.

Wally, I'm sorry that we'll probably just miss you. I'm hoping to be back home in Alaska early April.
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Old 03-08-2008, 01:57 PM   #13
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I looked around under the coach while I was checking on the steering gear box information. The situation is much better than I thought. There is a heavy metal frame around, but not attached to, the front of the generator box. You could drill small holes in that lower frame member to secure a bracket then, since the air duct under the generator does not move out with the generator, the lights could be mounted to that bracket and the lights would not move. Much easier than I thought before I crawled under to look at the situation. Just make sure that any holes drilled in the frame are small since that frame member requires its rigidity be maintained.
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Old 03-08-2008, 02:49 PM   #14
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My only thought on mounting in front of the generator is that the lights either be on a frame that can pivot out of the way to allow east access to the gen, or that they be mounted to the bracketry in front the gen that holds the fiberglass door on so that they would slide out with the gen.

I've found that if I install something that inhibits access to a maintenance item, I may be more prone to procrastinate... :-)
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Old 03-08-2008, 03:01 PM   #15
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I understand completely. Crawl under the front and I think you will see that mounting a bracket to the frame member I am talking about will not interfere with opening and closing the generator slide at all. The air duct under the center of the coach does not move out with the generator nor does the frame member I am referencing. Give me about an hour and I will post a photo of the front with the genset closed and open to better explain the situation.
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Old 03-08-2008, 04:12 PM   #16
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OK, let's see if a photo is worth a lot of words.

This is the frame member that a mounting bracket could be attached to from under the coach:


This is the frame member with the generator out showing that it does not move with the generator slide:


Front view of the frame member and fixed airduct:


The lights would have to be mounted on a bracket that allowed them to be close to the airduct and below the front cap to avoid the front cap closing against them.

Hope this helps.
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