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View Full Version : The Newell Coach Squish Effect. Values?


Yachts
03-24-2013, 01:42 AM
Before anything, I want to say I have owned a 96 with no slides and feel Newell is the best coach out there and a used Newell is light years away from most new motorhomes .

As new coaches are made every year the previous years coaches decrease in value.. Just like driving a new car off a lot.. But last years models then force the previous years models downward in price, and so on and so on.. I think of this like the older coaches and their prices being "squished" downward by newer nicer fancier coaches being available..

That being said I see two things happening to the market.. Pre 95 Newell's did not have the series 60 engine, (correct?), and that most people consider a huge upgrade over the old dd's..Im not sure when Newell's went to 45'ft but I think it was around that time..so mid 90's is a major break point in the Newells.

In 1997 slides began to emerge and that is the next major consideration in buying a Newell..from what I can see every slide is probly worth 15-20 k in price.
so this is my next observation.. A double slide 98 just sold at Motor homes of Texas for around 115--120.. I have seen some singles around asking 125 or so probably be happy to get 100 for them.. That should make and from what I see market wise a 95-96 no slides around 60-80 depending on condition.. ( I paid 200k for my 96 in 2002).. I just don't understand how so many owners have their coaches priced 50-100k over what the existing market is..just like older yachts their does come a point where the older boats level out in depreciation.. But in boats their's not been the major innovation of slides in the last 15 years. I'm thinking the slides are going to have an incredible effect on the market in the next 1-5 years.. Why would you want to pay 80 for a no slide when for 10k more you can have a slide.. Once multiple slide coaches break the 100k mark I think the no slides would be in the 60-70 range.. And pre 95's could be sub 40k if they are not their already and no slide 95-96 may not be far behind

I am in the market for another Newell right now and when I call on a coach and the owners ask what number do you have in mind before you fly cross the country to look at it and its like they are being insulted..there are several no slide coaches 95-96 models that people feel are worth 125... There is just no way... And as coaches get older the model year becomes less important.. Example I don't care if its a 95,96,97,98,99 to me they are the same.. Miles on Newell's dont matter even 200k is nothing for one of these. I see another break around 2001 when they changed the headlights and went to exterior air doors and steps.. But most if not all these coaches have slides so you are buying slides.. Then when the new body style came out in 2005 obviously that's a whole different animal...

I think There is a huge shift in the market that is getting ready to happen.. I would love to hear everyone else's thoughts..

thanks
Yachts

NewellCrazy
03-24-2013, 01:51 AM
Yachts,

Your observations are correct. Most owners cannot come to terms on what their Newell is actually worth and therefor shoot for the sky when trying to sell their coaches. If you're patient you will eventually score the deal your searching for its just a matter of time in my opinion. I wouldn't own a Newell without slides but that's me. It's just so much more room with slides and to me 2 slides in optimum although I wouldn't turn down a quad slide if the price was right.

Sean

ccjohnson
03-24-2013, 02:15 AM
It's all supply & demand. And a bit of splashy sales talk & marketing. I have always been amazed at how older Prevost's seem to be advertised for so much. Especially when I have compared them to our Newell.

Yachts
03-24-2013, 02:32 AM
Looking back ,my 96 has depreciated about 1000 per month since 2002... Obviously it couldnt depreciate that much a month going forward.. If anyone has a nice coach that they want to get reasonable on price.. I'm interested at anything up to 140k..I have looked at the single slide coach at parliament coach in Clearwater and adding a bedroom back.. I've heard they will take 68 k for a 97 single slide..

NEWELLWIZARD
03-24-2013, 02:36 AM
Yachts I'm not currently in the market to buy, but when I was looking before we purchased our Newell which was a few years ago. I would say the market was a lot stronger before. However the whole rving scene was a lot stronger too. I do keep an eye out here and there on what is going on with the resale of Newells. Nowadays I see Newells and other luxury coaches that are older for sale and people are still dreaming of getting that high price. Newells are worth the money yes, but with today's economy I do see it hurting the resale of these coaches. I don't see people getting what they are asking. If someone is willing to bargain they'll sell their coach fast, if not they better plan on keeping it a while. Maybe a long while. Good luck with finding another Newell!

Neweller
03-24-2013, 02:37 AM
Yachts, you definitely seem to be on the same page as I am. That is almost exactly how I see it. Some people get it and some don't. I have to believe some are not willing to take that big of a bath or maybe forget it's been 10-12 years since they originally purchased their Newell.

And instead of the old adage in real estate.....location, location, location....it's....condition, condition, condition.....

Now regarding the '95s, your assumptions is close, but they did come with both 8v92's and S60's. This was the changeover year.

If anyone's been reading around here, you will read where I've been trying to get some brave souls on board when the time comes to do major engine repairs, that to take the plunge and upgrade the engine. This will surely pay dividends for most of those who do. Of course you can't pay through the nose to do this, everything has to be relative.

I wish Newell would do slides for a reasonable amount, but I don't think that option will ever come to fruition, since they charge $150k per slide on new orders. If I had a shop like I used to, I would attempt it without second thoughts. And I would do them just like the factory does them, level. It's just a process of duplication, it can be done.

NEWELLWIZARD
03-24-2013, 02:38 AM
Looking back ,my 96 has depreciated about 1000 per month since 2002... Obviously it couldnt depreciate that much a month going forward.. If anyone has a nice coach that they want to get reasonable on price.. I'm interested at anything up to 140k..I have looked at the single slide coach at parliament coach in Clearwater and adding a bedroom back.. I've heard they will take 68 k for a 97 single slide..

Yachts that sounds like a good deal for the 97 single slide. You outta buy it! :thumbup:

Yachts
03-24-2013, 02:50 AM
My hesitations are it has 15k on the genset so its about worn out.. It's an executive coach so the rear meeting room has to be changed back to a bedroom. The bathroom is in front of the pocket air door. So you would have to leave the bedroom to use the toilet and the shower is small. If you do a new bedroom you might add a second bath.. But it has 2 chassis batteries and 0 house batteries.. By my guess you are looking at 20-30 k to make it "right" and at that point it's not a deal its just an average buy..

NEWELLWIZARD
03-24-2013, 02:56 AM
You're right after hearing that it doesn't sound like such a great deal. What happened to the house batteries? Are they selling it as is?

Yachts
03-24-2013, 02:58 AM
Yachts, you definitely seem to be on the same page as I am. That is almost exactly how I see it. Some people get it and some don't. I have to believe some are not willing to take that big of a bath or maybe forget it's been 10-12 years since they originally purchased their Newell.

And instead of the old adage in real estate.....location, location, location....it's....condition, condition, condition.....

Now regarding the '95s, your assumptions is close, but they did come with both 8v92's and S60's. This was the changeover year.

If anyone's been reading around here, you will read where I've been trying to get some brave souls on board when the time comes to do major engine repairs, that to take the plunge and upgrade the engine. This will surely pay dividends for most of those who do. Of course you can't pay through the nose to do this, everything has to be relative.

I wish Newell would do slides for a reasonable amount, but I don't think that option will ever come to fruition, since they charge $150k per slide on new orders. If I had a shop like I used to, I would attempt it without second thoughts. And I would do them just like the factory does them, level. It's just a process of duplication, it can be done.


Maybe we should start a new biz.. Doing slides to older Newell's... Lol while we are at it lets replace basement airs with roof airs too.. My 96 was one that had basement air issues.. And park on concrete with them I needed a fan under the coach to keep the air circulating and not build up heat...

Yachts
03-24-2013, 03:00 AM
You're right after hearing that it doesn't sound like such a great deal. What happened to the house batteries? Are they selling it as is?

Yes as is... But it has a killer custom tent setup.. It was the m and m corporate coach.. So if you are a Kyle Busch fan its worth more...lol

Yachts
03-24-2013, 03:23 AM
Here's another thought to ponder.. In 5 years the 2005 which is the newer body style will be as old as the 2000's are now.. Anyone think you could buy a 2005 in 5 years for under 200k? If it sells for as much as a 2000 now it maybe mid 100's..

Neweller
03-24-2013, 03:24 AM
Because Newell's in a unique market, I have to believe the buyers for slide upgrades truly are there. Similar to how company's take old and new buses and convert them. Most of the bus converters will do a conversion on both new and used chassis. To think the new converters start with a $750,000.00 Prevost chassis and small amount of MCI's. I always wondered what it really cost Newell to produce their own chassis? That has to be half their profit on a new coach. So, you know they make more per coach than a converter.

Neweller
03-24-2013, 03:32 AM
Here's another thought to ponder.. In 5 years the 2005 which is the newer body style will be as old as the 2000's are now.. Anyone think you could buy a 2005 in 5 years for under 200k? If it sells for as much as a 2000 now it maybe mid 100's..

Depending on the economy and such, Newell is currently only building 24 coaches a year when they had been building 48 plus, this could be a game changer in 5 years plus most will be quads.

77newell
03-30-2013, 02:15 PM
My conclusion from examining lots of high end motorhome prices is that selling prices decline about 50% over 10 years. The first few years from new may have a different pattern, but I've been surprised at the consistency of this pattern when applied to coaches more than a few years old. Older professionally converted Prevosts may be an exception when they get more than 20 years old as their prices seem to flatten out more than say Newells and Foretravels, again depending on condition - a crappy coach will sell for way lower no matter who built it. It also seems that high end coaches depreciate more in the early years than more moderately built brands.

Yachts
03-30-2013, 02:43 PM
I agree with you but at 10 -15 years what surprises me is it doesn't seem to stop.. I paid 200 for my 96 in 2001 and its worth and if I was buying it back i wouldn't give more than 75 for it now. NOt because it wasnt awesome but because of what else you can buy just above it. My plan right now is to buy. Something around 100 keep it for 5 years or so and then try to buy an 06 "new body style" and keep,the old one for my kids to use.. It won't be worth much but will give the kids something to use.. I have 6 of them.. Someone would like it.. Lol...I figure in 5 years the 06 should be in the low 200s. That's what the 2001's are selling for now...

77newell
03-30-2013, 03:06 PM
Yachts: I agree it doesn't stop. I bought my 77 coach 10 years ago for about $40,000, today it is worth about half that and I expect in another 10 years it will be half again though if well cared for it may decline more slowly but maybe not. At some point I would expect it to level off commensurate with condition, I had expected that when I bought it and it hasn't happened yet. For those coaches that are farther up the depreciation curve I see no reason the 50% per decade won't continue for a long time.

Gone Busing
03-30-2013, 05:18 PM
From our following of things it appears most of the information in this thread is very accurate.

jdaniel
03-31-2013, 12:46 AM
I bought my 1991 6-7 years ago for 133k. That was a little high but the condition and the updated interior sold me. If it had ONE slide I'd be happy!

ccjohnson
03-31-2013, 01:39 AM
Jimmy,
We had same thing about wanting a slide on our '92. After the remodel, I have decided I do have 1 slide (counting the step cover).

Neweller
03-31-2013, 02:12 AM
Jimmy, that is a little over a $10k a year in depreciation which is actually not all that bad. Imagine a new owner easily giving up over 100k a year for the same amount of time and use that you enjoyed. Divide that over 12 months and you own the coach whether or not its sits, rolls down the road or has a mortgage at only $800-$1000.00 a month. Not too shabby to claim that kind of luxury. Of course if it's paid for it is a whole lot better.

I have to believe Clint saying; to hell with loosing anymore equity buying another to take a beatin' on, it's cheaper to remodel it the way you like it.

We can also talk on the slide option in another thread if someone wants to. We can discuss some possible ways to achieve slides and the cost differences.

jdaniel
03-31-2013, 02:52 AM
And that's why we are going so slow. We still love our coach and its been long paid for :)

77newell
03-31-2013, 04:57 PM
Appreciating what you have is the secret to a happier life. Any time I begin to lust after a bigger coach I just remind myself that my parents had a terrific time camping out of a van with a platform bed in the back and no curtains. Then when I look at the relative luxury of my vintage 35 footer I am in awe of what I have in comparison.

jdaniel
03-31-2013, 08:17 PM
Appreciating what you have is the secret to a happier life. Any time I begin to lust after a bigger coach I just remind myself that my parents had a terrific time camping out of a van with a platform bed in the back and no curtains. Then when I look at the relative luxury of my vintage 35 footer I am in awe of what I have in comparison.
Well said!

JustDustin
03-31-2013, 09:26 PM
Appreciating what you have is the secret to a happier life. Any time I begin to lust after a bigger coach I just remind myself that my parents had a terrific time camping out of a van with a platform bed in the back and no curtains. Then when I look at the relative luxury of my vintage 35 footer I am in awe of what I have in comparison.

I agree Jon. :(y):

Maxwell55
04-05-2013, 07:01 PM
is it just me or what? i see a lot of older coaches out there and it seems to me some folks are asking too much. i guess that's why i haven't purchased a coach yet. yall know what i mean?

Yachts
04-05-2013, 07:41 PM
Oh yeah... The asking market is ridiculous .. but some people being patient enough have gotten some fair deals.. someone just bought a 98 double slide for around120...

Jack Fouts
04-06-2013, 12:25 AM
I'm not sure if any others have noticed, but is sure seems like some of the Newell Classic's are bringing darn near the same money as the eary 2000 series? I have spoken to a few owners that have sold theres. Does anyone feel a shift in the market lately?

rellick
04-06-2013, 01:02 AM
Doesn't seem to be many classics for sale right now

MrE
04-06-2013, 01:37 AM
Doesn't seem to be many classics for sale right now

I heard that there's some guy up in Canada buying them all up. rollinglol

The Newell
04-06-2013, 02:20 AM
I've noticed it goes one of two ways, either way over priced or priced right at or under market value. Those ones of course are gone quick and the rest well they're still for sale.

Joseph

Neweller
04-06-2013, 02:31 AM
You guys are right, the classics are kind of drying up for some reason. I'm wondering maybe if it could be the anti-squish effect. Most are owned free against any kind of leans and many folks are not willing to give them away and just decide to keep them. I know a couple of owners who keeping there classic's around even though they bought a newer coach.

There are those guys that decided to garage their muscle cars after replacing them once upon a time and now just take them out for a chill fest.

There are several advantages to owning them just like with bus conversions. Look at the cost of registration and insurance on a classic vs. a newer coach. It's huge in most states. The same goes for taxes and many repairs. In some states after a certain age you can get permanent plates on them for a small one-time fee.

So, imagine you owned one that was completely gone through, had updated equipment and so on....., ownership from the point on as long as you were satisfied with what you had, would be extremely reasonable, leaving a lot of change left to go travel in the off season.:thumbup:

Maybe we should have started a thread called the Anti-Squish Effect? :typing:

larryweikart
04-06-2013, 03:24 AM
Well, here's a 1979 for sale in Sebring Fl. that I stopped to ask about but the owner wasn't there to answer any questions. It is getting ready for a repaint but the interior looked pretty nice 37933794

speedingsport
04-06-2013, 07:07 AM
Larry what were they wanting for that 79?

larryweikart
04-06-2013, 04:35 PM
Unfortunately I was there just as the last person was leaving and he didn't know and I was on my way out of town. It is owned by the person who owns Ducks Body Shop In Sebring, Fl. The phone# is 863 385-8811.