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View Full Version : Non Slide Newell VS Non Slide Prevost Values...what the heck is going on?????


Dave-n-Marjorie
05-24-2013, 04:14 AM
Ok guys and gals, I am in a quandry and cant wait to hear all the feedback. Marjorie and I own a 96 non slide bath and a half raised roof Series 60 with 65k miles. If you check out our prior posts, we have fully updated the coach putting more than $20k+ in it with no major issues. We purchased from original owner. You would not believe how many people talk about our coach and want us to give them a tour of it at the RV Resort we own a lot (Hilton Head Island Motorcoach Resort).

So today a 95 marathon xl Prevost comes in to rent for a few weeks and I end up chatting with the owner. He wanted to check out our coach so we give him the usual tour. HE IS AMAZED!! After that, he didnt want to even show us his Prevost but eventually did. His Prevost was not touched in 17 years and had lots of pinks, blues, tube tv's ect...but it was nice for sure.

So then we start talking values.........He bragged about only paying $100k for it.....Shopped for over a year all over.....he lost a few on ebay, but four of the ones that sold cheap on ebay he went to visit and said they were junk. Was on www.philcooper.com (http://www.philcooper.com) daily. He even stayed at Pelican Lake for a week in Naples Prevost hunting. He wanted a non Royale, something under 100k miles, and one or two owners, and wanted all books, ect....and basically something not trashed but taken care of. He wanted a Series 60 but knew he couldnt find one under $100k in the shape he wanted.

So now my quandry.........Why the heck are Newells priced so low??? I have read lots of posts on here where a few members think a non slide Newell with a Series 60 is worth between $60 - $80k. It doesnt make any sense unless I am missing something. In my opinion, a Newell should be worth waaaay MORE than a cookie cutter Prevost conversion. It is VERY hard to find Newells, and usually there are less than 3 non slide series 60's out there at any given time. Side by side comparison Newell would win in many catagories. Heck, this Prevost guy today wanted a bath and a half, but knew to get one in a Prevost with no slides would cost him OVER $200k.

Yes....there are Newell "deals" out there. Someone dumping one trading it in for an upgrade, bank repo, or just someone desperate that needs the cash. But for every Newell "deal" there are dozens of Prevost deals. Newell owners are such a close family, we should be the first ones to know price should equal quality and vice versa!

After my Newell tour and talk with this Prevost owner, I asked him if he would have bought mine for $100k. His eyes opened wide and said, heck yes!!! He would put his on ebay tomorrow and give me a deposit. Now, there is no way I am selling, as he wants what I have, but I have what I want. Then he looked at me, and said....$100k really???? what is the matter with it??????

And then it hit me.....I hear Prevost owners are waaaaay tigher than Newell owners. They hold their pricing. They talk about holding it on boards and at rallys. They know what they have and command their price....and they get it.... Most rvers really dont know what a Newell is...and when they see a 45' bus, series 60 for $60 or $70k.....they say....omg whats the matter with it???????

I truely believe we need to acknowledge and adopt and brag about TRUE Newell pricing across the board....classics, 6v's 8Vs, series 60s, slides, ect.... The values, not the "deals". These things are top two of all rvs, RAREST top RV, and most of all, hand built SOLID to last forever!

People dont hesitate to drop $100k for a non slide Prevost, $225k for a double slide Prevost....why wont they for Newells???????????

Lets change this attitude together!!!!

ccjohnson
05-24-2013, 04:24 AM
Works for us!

Neweller
05-24-2013, 06:04 AM
Dave, I agree with most of up you are saying and have scratched my head and pondered the same idea for about 10 years now, nothing has really changed. The market on comparable coaches of like age and condition have been around the same the whole time I have been associated with Newell's.

What seems to hurt them the most is that there has never been a "Book Value" available and you have to rely on appraisals or the factory to establish a value. The factory does not offer much toward the value of a 10 year or older coach so that is when they really start to dive in price. If you called and asked the factory what a your coach was worth you might be surprised. Now I have never personally asked the factory what an older coach is worth, but have spoken to a half dozen owners, ex-owners and finance companies who have asked for reference and they have all surprised me a little with the perceived values they had been told. I won't quote values but only say call and ask what they would give or think your coach is worth.

The valuation process also hurts the possibility for financing and so most owners of 10 year old coaches usually pay cash or get an equity loan, which in today's lending arena those types of loans are much tougher to obtain.

I myself am somewhat guilty of quoting such values, but only do to what I've learned studying the sales of coaches year after year. I would love to see the prices stabilize or even increase so most owners retain a much fairer realistic true value across the board. I believe what you are saying is obtainable. Maybe what hurts it some is that some buyers are hoping and waiting to nail a great deal and by holding out for a deal, sales become more slower which from a marketing standpoint creates lower values.

I too have been so confused as to why Prevost retain such a high value. I do know that they sell themselves on the fact that they are a bus and can obtain a life use of well over 2 million miles, but then Newell is built from the ground up to be a luxury coach bar none and end of story......

Why do celebrities mostly purchase Prevost conversions and rarely Newell's. I'm sure if they were made aware, that would change as most don't read MH magazine which is where Newell seems to do a large percentage of advertising.

Something else I would attribute to the great success and high values of Prevosts, is the fact that there are so many premium convertors out there marketing, building and catering to the "rich and famous" much more than one sole company such as Newell can muster. Another thing that I have spoken to many about is the image of the Newell factory compared to some of the Prevost converters, have you seen or been to any of these companies. Talk about the accessorized bling in the showrooms, lounges and so forth, it's quite the flash going on and that attracts the money.

It's getting late and I will quit blabbing for now and ponder your question a little further and think about how we can help one another improve our coach bottom lines as well.

Thanks for your wonderful thoughts and serious concern. I believe you are onto something here and we should probably get our heads into the game a bit more as many owners have already gotten a ton of skin in it already.

folivier
05-24-2013, 11:57 AM
Like most of us when people ask about our Newell they think we paid at least twice what we did. The few times I tell someone what we paid they are astounded.
That said, and the fact that we have the Newell that we want, I wish the price would shoot up!
A lot of people can't get over the fact that a used Newell costs less than a new S&B.
Hopefully we are just at the bottom and prices may start going up again. Talk to someone who bought 4 years ago.

Twins
05-24-2013, 02:40 PM
Heck I wish the pricing would come down lower so that I can afford a newer Newell. The goal should be to find a deal that you can use for a couple years and then sell it for the same or more then what you paid. Nothing wrong with that!

STUNNING COACH
05-24-2013, 03:14 PM
The DW and I ask ourselves the same question time and time again. We have given up on the as to why a Prevost Conversion ill-equipped will fetch a higher dollar than a much nicer Newell Coach. We looked at dozens of Prevosts thinking that was what we wanted and then by chance came along a Newell. I think the answer is awareness.

Dave-n-Marjorie
05-24-2013, 03:47 PM
Ken, you have a point about black book wholesale values. I think its actually a good thing Newells are not in them. Working for dealers and having access to the nationwide dealer nada connect system and going to manheim RV auctions, it is amazing how most of the general public have no clue what a dealer is really giving them if they trade in any RV. A perfect example is a 2004 Newmar Essex. 45', 500 hp, quad slide, high end coach. The real value on RV is not the connect book price but 70-80% of that price. Less than 50k miles, good tires, a dealer would think long and hard to give $100,000 in real money. Ive seen nice ones with less miles and one year old tires go for in the $80s at the auctions, they wash it and sell it for $150k plus who knows how much they will make on a trade.

Not just picking on Newmars as I feel they are a great coach. 45' Quad slide Monaco Signatures with detroit diesel series 60 engines go for about $100k but have to be in pristine condition. Those are high line 45' 500hp 4 slide fiberglass RVs and it only goes down from there!!!

With a Newell, we are so exclusive, so limited, WE should set the market price. What is happening right now, is that some are so desperate to sell, it is creating a price war. That makes no sense when there are only a few in the entire nation!!! If they are desperate, they should say "short sale" or "by before bank gets it", something like that.

When you look at a true buyer, there are bus people and everyone else. I myself could have chosen from dozens of 45' 500hp quad slide fiberglass rvs, or a non slide bus. Remember we are full timers 365 days a year in this thing!!! I chose a Newell non slide!!! Im a bus guy. That is our market. Bus people. Price will not convert them. Stick to your price, hold your ground, heck some need to raise their price on Newells. When a bus person sees something they want, they will pay. They have the money. A small investment to update and upgrade will pay off big time on your Newells value. Prevost owners dont have to upgrade to get top dollar, why?

Dealers who wouldnt hesitate to put my coach on their lot and ask $130k for it. They would get it too. They would cater to a bus person, educate them, and most of all, say there are only a few of these in the USA, if you wait, someone else will snap it up!

Hopefully this makes sense to current Newell owners who are selling. Your coach is one of the best ever made and RARE. You deserve top dollar!!!!

Newellin Thunder
05-24-2013, 06:37 PM
I have to agree that Newell's are under valued. Great for the consumer bad for seller which means it's all about the buy. I know of a 1998 double slide in great condition ready for fulltiming and the seller will take 90K. I was thinking about buying it myself just to resale.

Dave-n-Marjorie
05-25-2013, 02:48 AM
I have a buyer for $110k cash can close in 5 days sight unseen if it is clean and clear and right floorplan and will immediatly wire a $5,000 non refundable deposit upon passing inspection. He plans on reselling for $150k - $160k or more and he will get it. PM me with the information if its is a real coach and a real deal.....Just think....you could make a quick $20k!!!! I will do all the dealer paperwork for free. Who wouldnt turn that down?????

I will be happy to keep everyone on here updated on this deal and make sure you get your $20k if they buy it.

I have to agree that Newell's are under valued. Great for the consumer bad for seller which means it's all about the buy. I know of a 1998 double slide in great condition ready for fulltiming and the seller will take 90K. I was thinking about buying it myself just to resale.

Yachts
05-25-2013, 02:59 AM
I'd be interested too... I had my coach worked on at a dealer and he offered me 100k for my 99 no slide.. Said compared to the other stuff on his lot at 150-200 ours is a steal... But something I noticed.. 3-4 months ago there were several no slide 96 and newer no slides for sale.. There are none around now.. Could the market have turned?

ccjohnson
05-25-2013, 03:07 AM
Maybe with a lot of folks doing make-over & upgrades to older Newell's; it has been enough to turn the market up.

express1
05-25-2013, 03:14 AM
I have a buyer for $110k cash can close in 5 days sight unseen if it is clean and clear and right floorplan and will immediatly wire a $5,000 non refundable deposit upon passing inspection. He plans on reselling for $150k - $160k or more and he will get it. PM me with the information if its is a real coach and a real deal.....Just think....you could make a quick $20k!!!! I will do all the dealer paperwork for free. Who wouldnt turn that down?????

I will be happy to keep everyone on here updated on this deal and make sure you get your $20k if they buy it.


Surely if you want a coach of this caliber please contact me .... I've got what you want and ready to roll... But after August she leaves for summer in CO.


Can forward info and pictures.

matt russo Express1
985-637-6811
mjr1105@hotmail.com

stewart33
05-25-2013, 03:28 AM
Maybe with a lot of folks doing make-over & upgrades to older Newell's; it has been enough to turn the market up.

I agree with you Clint I'm sure that has a lot to do with it.

I think people who may not have known about Newells before are finding out they truly are a luxury coach worth owning.

Neweller
05-25-2013, 03:37 AM
Earnest, is the coach you are speaking of the one owned by the boat dealer?

Dave, I know of a 1999 dual slide Newell and the owners would get real motivated if they can sell there lot in NC along with it. They are currently using it once a month down in a park in Florida.

jack14r
05-25-2013, 03:42 PM
Dave,I think that the marketplace has spoken,and many might ask why is there this difference?If we look at 1996,Newell might have built 30 or so and Prevost converters might have done 125 and the entertainer guys might have done 100 or more,also Prevost built hundreds for the seated coach market.The prevost is built with a stainless steel monocoque construction verses a mild steel bridge construction,the Prevost has proven this design is capable of 2,000,000 miles.Another area that is important to a used buyer is service and because of Prevost's commitment to the seated coach industry they have 6 national service centers with national parts distribution with overnite delivery,Prevost still supports coaches that are 30 years old.The individuals that work on trucks and have worked on a Prevost will tell you that they have never seen anything with running gear and chassis as robust as a Prevost.I am not saying that the Prevost is superior just that the buyers have determined the used value of each product.I believe that the Prevost is the best bus and the Newell is the best motor home.

farmell
05-25-2013, 05:04 PM
I tend to agree with Jack on this. I have owned two Prevost and on my second Newell. I loved them all. I have many friends whom own Prevost and I too would take another. I went with Newell due of the slide options at the time and then bought another. My current Newell is probably my last coach but then again I said that before. A good friends Outlaw would make juices flow.

NewellCrazy
05-25-2013, 06:17 PM
Wow Jack you definitely know your stuff. I agree that Prevost makes the best bus and Newell Motorhome.

Racer3001
05-25-2013, 06:28 PM
Dave,I think that the marketplace has spoken,and many might ask why is there this difference?If we look at 1996,Newell might have built 30 or so and Prevost converters might have done 125 and the entertainer guys might have done 100 or more,also Prevost built hundreds for the seated coach market.The prevost is built with a stainless steel monocoque construction verses a mild steel bridge construction,the Prevost has proven this design is capable of 2,000,000 miles.Another area that is important to a used buyer is service and because of Prevost's commitment to the seated coach industry they have 6 national service centers with national parts distribution with overnite delivery,Prevost still supports coaches that are 30 years old.The individuals that work on trucks and have worked on a Prevost will tell you that they have never seen anything with running gear and chassis as robust as a Prevost.I am not saying that the Prevost is superior just that the buyers have determined the used value of each product.I believe that the Prevost is the best bus and the Newell is the best motor home.


Are the XLII Prevosts drivers & passengers seats level or down below in the same fashion as the Prevost H3-45 which I don't care for. Reason being in case your in an accident and sitting low your probably toast.

Devon

qcj
05-25-2013, 11:28 PM
I live in Nacogdoches and this is Foretravel country. I have owned 6 motorhomes and my last one was a Foretravel before I bought my Newell. I didn't ever know what an older Newell looked like until Motorhomes of Texas started selling them. I did know what a Prevost looked like. One reason there are ten times more of them than Newells. After MOT started selling used Newell I started looking at them. I would go over on weekend when they closed and crawing around under them and looking at them real close, and I decided man these things are something else. They are built like tanks. One of these days I really would like to own one.

Being there are so few of them people don't know what they are. I have people ask me what kind of MH you own and I tell them, and haven't clue what I'm taking about. But looking at it in another way, it is sorta nice owning something not everyone can have. There are not near enought Newells to go around. Chappell

jack14r
05-26-2013, 12:57 AM
The XLII seats are at the same level,the passenger seat is a little further aft to accommodate the entrance steps.I really like the looks of an XLII but I like the interior space of the H3,the newest floor plans do not have enough closet space,this is a result of the exhaust system exiting through the roof which took up at least 40 percent of the rear closet.My 2008 XLII is the last year of the full rear closet that Prevost manufactured,I doubt that we would be happy with less space.

Racer3001
05-26-2013, 02:27 AM
Closet space is important to my wife and I and I'm not sure what coach fits us best Prevost or Newell.

Randy J
05-26-2013, 02:40 AM
Racer3001

Have you checked out the inside of some Newell Coaches you are interested in? I'm sure it will have plenty of closet space. Either way they are both luxury coaches you're going to win. We fell across our Newell had no idea what they were but we sure are glad we did.

Slides or no slides a Newell coach rocks my world!

SantaFe
05-28-2013, 07:44 PM
Great discussion...I love Newell Coaches but I'm a realist...
Have never seen or heard of documented > 1 millon mile Newell have you'll?
On the other hand 1-2 million mile Prevosts I have seen several.
Comparing Newell to Prevost is like Cessna to Bonanza or Craftsman to Snap On...etc
All great products but each different...
Market value is not set by owners or sellers, someone on this thread said to call Newell and see what trade value is...ask yourself why Newell blows out wholesale to MOT, Holland, Pantera, etc these old no slide and ten yr+coaches
Why don't they refurb and market them? Rare has no direct correlation to value that is a myth
If any RV's are a 'good' investment why do they have a history of depreciating Every year?
Enjoy them and keep it real!!!!
Note: look at history of Manheim, Adesa, and the other dealer auctions for Newell prices... that will sober you up...

Yachts
05-28-2013, 08:29 PM
This is how I see it.. Newell doesnt carry any coach over 10 years with a few minor exceptions because it is very hard to get financing on them.. But if you buy a Newell from Newell you will pay on average 50 to 100k more than anywhere else.. 2 Reasons are one, Newell provides a 2 year 24000 mile warranty on the whole coach.. the other reason is owners if they cosign with newell normally pay a refurb fee to make the coach perfect and a seller fee to Newell when it sells.. Right now the 04 quad at NEwell can be bought from them in the mid 300's the same year from individuals can be had for mid 200's from private individuals.. But you assume the risk if something breaks.. Now you can fix a lot for 50-100k but thats the difference..

The other issue is supply and demand..3 Months ago there were 4-5 96-99 no slides out there for sale.. I bought a 99 no slide for 80 k. the seller was going to Hire someone to consign it and they were gonna ask 110 but by the time he paid commission and hassled with the unknown. he offerd it to me for 80k and i only lived 40 miles from him.

Prevosts pre 2005 drove better than a Newell. But an XLII and An h45 have less than 41 feet of convertible space in a Prevost.. The Newells have all 45 feet convertible.. Thats why they say if you drive all the time a Prevost rides better BUT a Newell Lives better..

jack14r
05-28-2013, 11:39 PM
Yachts,I think you hit it on the head,Newell and most Prevost converters do not want to mess with anything 10 years or older because it is difficult to get a lender to lend money on what they think is such an old coach.The market has spoken and none of us can change these values.Your last paragraph I think is very true,the Newell does really have 45 feet of usable space and the Prevost is the better driver.

Dave-n-Marjorie
05-29-2013, 02:38 AM
I am quite sure Newell wholesales older coaches as their FLOORPLAN does not allow Rvs older than 10 or 11 years. It has ABSOLUTLY nothing to do with "value". Every dealer knows that. I work for one. If Newell decided to renovate a 10+ year old coach, they would first have to get a high interest Floorplan for that coach, then pay Curtailment on that coach each month it does not sell from the time they acquired it counting the time they are fixing it up. When you count the time and manpower it takes to renovate one, it is just not worth it profitability wise, especially when you count dealer PAC they have to pay.

I'm on Manheim daily for more than 4 years now, and havent seen a good deal other than the one I bought. I probably looked at a dozen of them. Most all on there are repos that should be or are the way to being totalled.

Great discussion...I love Newell Coaches but I'm a realist...
Have never seen or heard of documented > 1 millon mile Newell have you'll?
On the other hand 1-2 million mile Prevosts I have seen several.
Comparing Newell to Prevost is like Cessna to Bonanza or Craftsman to Snap On...etc
All great products but each different...
Market value is not set by owners or sellers, someone on this thread said to call Newell and see what trade value is...ask yourself why Newell blows out wholesale to MOT, Holland, Pantera, etc these old no slide and ten yr+coaches
Why don't they refurb and market them? Rare has no direct correlation to value that is a myth
If any RV's are a 'good' investment why do they have a history of depreciating Every year?
Enjoy them and keep it real!!!!
Note: look at history of Manheim, Adesa, and the other dealer auctions for Newell prices... that will sober you up...

Dave-n-Marjorie
05-29-2013, 02:50 AM
You have some great points Yachts. My question is...If you can find a 04 Quad slide Newell for $250k,,,,how much can you find a 04 Quad slide PREVOST for????? If its a toss up Newell vs Prevost quality ect... then that means Quad slide Prevosts should be $250k right? If you cant find some quad slide Prevosts for $250k then I would ask why the difference????

the same year from individuals can be had for mid 200's from private individuals

Gax
05-29-2013, 03:22 AM
Something I have noticed is a fair share of folks think that Newells are one in the same with Newmars. Could it be possible that is why there is some discredit the value of a Newell?

Yachts
05-29-2013, 03:26 AM
I agree you can't find a prevost quad slide for anywhere near 250. Or 350 for that matter.. In comparison i agree a newell is better than a prevost.. That's why I bought my first one and my second one.. But if someone wants to sell theirs cheap they can do that..

You guys have a 96 no slide you just remodeled? Would you take 100k for it? Knowing you might find a single or double slide around the same number? I bought a 99 no slide and the thing that set mine apart was 4 girard awnings and only 1700 hours on the gen set and the coach is like new inside.. I plan on adding about 30k to it in new paint and other upgrades over the next year or so.. Could I find a double slide for less than what I might have in this? Yes but my wife and I are weekenders and I rather have a coach that is custom to my tastes than one with slides for the same $.. My opinion. But if a triple slide comes around for 120 or a double for 90 or so, I am in!!:)

Dave-n-Marjorie
05-31-2013, 02:41 AM
Great questions Yachts.....Would I take $100k for my 96 series 60 non slide bath and a half that is 100% remodeled and updated, 65k miles...???? Probably not....The reason why?????...............I have been in the this coach every day for 6 months full time. I know every inch, inside, outside, hidden in walls, every system, tank, switch, EVERYTHING....It is the floorplan we want....the options we want....colors we want......low miles, one owner....ect.....

With the few Newells on the market.....how would I find that???? Is one even out there??? Then find one with two slides on top of that??? It would take about the same time to get to know another coach with slides and that could be very very expensive to get to know another coach. I found a quad slide for $130k....it needed $140k+ of work and it also had 200k+ miles....I found a double slide for $135...high miles...bad floorplan...bad colors... 5 owners....slide seals needed replaced...tires....batteries.....hwh not working right......ect....no...I didnt want that either....would have been into it for $200k....There is one on here for $90k...steal of the century!!!!!! in my opinion...upgrade it for $20k and you are only into it for $110k....how much can you find a double slide PREVOST FOR???

For those wannabees waiting for the perfect Newell....times are a changin.....you better act fast or you will be looking at double slide gas fleetwood bounders for the smae amount of money......these Newells are RARE....and when the ones that want to give them away do...there will be nothing left and a Prevost will be 40% more money!!!



I agree you can't find a prevost quad slide for anywhere near 250. Or 350 for that matter.. In comparison i agree a newell is better than a prevost.. That's why I bought my first one and my second one.. But if someone wants to sell theirs cheap they can do that..

You guys have a 96 no slide you just remodeled? Would you take 100k for it? Knowing you might find a single or double slide around the same number? I bought a 99 no slide and the thing that set mine apart was 4 girard awnings and only 1700 hours on the gen set and the coach is like new inside.. I plan on adding about 30k to it in new paint and other upgrades over the next year or so.. Could I find a double slide for less than what I might have in this? Yes but my wife and I are weekenders and I rather have a coach that is custom to my tastes than one with slides for the same $.. My opinion. But if a triple slide comes around for 120 or a double for 90 or so, I am in!!:)

Yachts
05-31-2013, 03:01 AM
PM me about the double slide for $90k, I'm very interested