Tech Talk Archives 7

[Neweller]

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769 9/5/2002 2:12:04 PM 9/5/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com battery converter/charger The Newell house/engine start 12-volt electrical systems have remained remarkably unchanged for over 20 years. With few exceptions, all coaches have been equipped with flooded cell 8D batteries for both the engine start and the house banks of batteries. It is recommended not to mix two different battery types on a single charging source. Wanting to avoid the need for separate charging systems for each battery bank, we selected a single battery type to use on both banks that is technically a starting battery, but performs remarkably well in what would be considered a deep cycle application. We have seen typical battery life of 3 to 5 years. Flooded cell 8D batteries are readily available across the country and are relatively inexpensive, often in the range of $120 to $150 each. Both the engine and house batteries are charged from the engine alternator while driving, and from the 120 volt charger (a converter/charger years ago or an inverter/charger in more recent years) when ac current is available, be it generator or shorepower. The Litton Triad converter/charger incorporated in the mid-1970s was the first good, reliable charger we found that allowed for continuous electrical hookup without boiling batteries. The combination inverter/chargers introduced in the mid-1980s were even better, originally with Heart Interface products and now the Statpower ProSine 3000 watt sine wave inverter/charger being original factory equipment today. (As has been mentioned on this thread, Heart, Trace, and Statpower have all merged into one company in recent years.) While we have had good reliability and performance with flooded cell 8D batteries, through the years we have consistently had problems when we tried sealed gel cell batteries. While they are Òmaintenance free,Ó gel batteries typically have a life of two years or less in our application, with some failing within a few weeks. Here, the definition of Òmaintenance freeÓ comes into play. We have also equipped a number of coaches in recent years on special order with absorbed glass mat (AGM) batteries, a modern technology that is maintenance free, appear to be reliable, and provides marginally more electrical storage capacity than flooded cell batteries. However, the AGM batteries are quite expensive at about $400 each and can be hard to find out in the hinderlands when replacements are needed. We recommend AGM batteries for customers expecting to do a considerable amount of dry camping, but believe that the old fashioned, inexpensive, and readily available wet cell 8D battery is a good solution for the majority of customers.

[Neweller]

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770 9/6/2002 10:37:36 AM 9/7/2002 Dennis Bruce trishoreyachts@attcanada.net transmission replacement I was considering changing from a 4-speed to the newer 6-speed Allison World Transmission. I have an 87 coach with an 8V92 engine. Can it be done and do you think I would gain that much in coach speed? Right now I am max cruise at 65. I have also been told that the jake brake works better. Can you suggest any way to get more road speed out of the existing set up? For instance, what do you think is a max cruising rpm for this engine? Thank you.

[Neweller]

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771 9/6/2002 8:43:43 PM 9/7/2002 Kelly Scott kscott6264@netscape.net Pre-Owned Newell Coach Likewise I agree on who cares as long as it's a Newell. I know I will upgrade in a couple of years, and will use the factory, and any other source, but we will purchase another Newell. We read every post and the education is wonderful for us.

Keep up the good work gentlemen,

Kelly

[Neweller]

772 9/6/2002 8:52:13 PM 9/7/2002 Kelly Scott kscott6264@netscape.net Tag Axle Paranoia!? We enjoy pulling up to the toll booth on the turnpikes, they count your axle's, you drive away saving a little change. If Newell sent it out with 2 axle's, I assure you you it does not need a third. Price buying 10 tires against 6 tires, another saving of pocket change.
Kelly

[Neweller]

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773 9/6/2002 8:55:21 PM 9/7/2002 Jim Weckman jweckman@hutchtel.net Winter Operations Some of the most enjoyable times traveling in our coach have been in the winter. We have been on extended trips were the temp has been well below zero, without problems. The only addition to the advice given, is that in very cold conditions we will open cabinet doors under sinks and behind the shower to allow warm air into plumbing areas. Be sure to run exhaust fans when using the shower or when cooking, this will reduce the condensation on the windshield and windows.

[Neweller]

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774 9/6/2002 9:37:32 PM 9/7/2002 Jim Weckman jweckman@hutchtel.net Tag Axle Paranoia!? There probably is no "best way to go". We owned an 84 40' two axle coach, and now an 89 three axle. Both handle and drive well. The 84 was about 33,000#, and the 89 about 37,000#. The point being, the tag becomes required with added weight of the coach. On the plus side, the two axle coach will have more storage, and one less axle to maintain, not to mention two less tires to buy. I would suggest that you look at what your life style will be on the road,(how much stuff you need to have with you) drive the coach to a public scale and weigh it. Get weights for front and drive axle along with total weight. If what you need to live on the road will fit and will not over gross front or rear axles, you should have no problems.

[Neweller]

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775 9/7/2002 8:38:58 AM 9/7/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com transmission replacement Retrofitting an Allison World Transmission to a coach delivered new with the HT741 4-speed transmission is mechanically not challenging but not cost effective. But it may be interesting to review this suggestion. A 1987 Newell was delivered new with the engine governed at 2100 rpm plus a 150 rpm over-run. With the standard axle ratio of 3.55/1, this would yeild a top speed of slightly over 80 mph. Therefore, the reported 65 mph top speed indicates something unusual that should be identified. Either the engine will not reach the recommended governed setting for some undetermined reason or the axle ratio has been changed. Regarding the retrofit of an Allison World Transmission, the primary benefit offered by extra two gear ranges offered by the new transmission is a lower rpm high gear for highway cruising. This does push the top speed to over 90 mph, although we suggest that this is not something the owner can often or should utilize. However, at a given cruising speed, say 65 mph, the engine turns perhaps 200 rpm slower than a coach equipped with a 4-speed Allison and 3.55/1 axle ratio. The 1st gear and high gear ratios of the World Transmission do not match the older 4-speed, with the World Transmission offering overdrive ratios in 5th and 6th gears, 0.74/1 and 0.64/1 respectively. Therefore, the axle ratio would require changing, another expense. To offer the proper balance between moving from a stop, acceleration, and cruising rpm, Newell uses a 4.30 axle ratio with the 4000MH World Transmission. The total cost of retrofitting the World Transmission and changing the axle ratio would probably exceed $20,000. This doesn't sound like a good deal to us. Also, regarding the jake brake, the major improvement we've seen is due to the Serie 60 engine. Aside from small differences due to gear ratios and the benefit of the World Transmission automatically downshifting for jake brake operation, we don't know of any differences in jake brake performance between the transmissions.

[Neweller]

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776 9/8/2002 3:01:42 PM 9/8/2002 Dick Wells dickwells@classicnet.net Tag Axle Paranoia!? We owned an 89 Newell with two axles and were very happy with it. We liked the additional storage where the tag axle
would have been. Sold it thinking we would get into the new
body style - wound up buying an 89 with a tag axle but
thinking I would sooner have the two axle coach. As it turns
out I really like the tag axle. I think it rides better and sticks to the highway better than the two axle. It's a great coach & Newell does it right whichever you wind up with.

[Neweller]

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778 9/10/2002 9:50:26 AM 9/11/2002 otto burleson bigdog1930@yahoo.com Tag Axle Paranoia!? For Staff: What is the approx difference - if any - of a 40ft 2 axle coach and that of a 3 axle coach - panic stop - 50 mph - dry payment.

[Neweller]

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780 9/11/2002 1:37:27 PM 9/11/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com Tag Axle Paranoia!? All else being equal, a three axle coach, with two more tires and two more brakes, will stop shorter than a two axle coach. However, it would require some carefully designed specific testing to try to quantify the difference, and the changes in brake and tire specifications through the years would probably make the difference not consistent from year to year.

[Neweller]

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781 9/16/2002 9:13:02 AM 9/18/2002 John Leuenberger jeleuen@attglobal.net Overheating/engine smoke Took first outing of 150 mile one way distance in '82 with 6V92TA, mileage 133000. Ambient temp low 90's along GulF Coast. Doing about 70 mph noticed engine water temp close to 215 degrees. Slowed to 65 mph and temp went to about 212 degrees. Engine oil temp 225, trans oil temp 210, oil press 55. On starting engine next day got a big cloud of white smoke, cleared up in about one minute. It never did this before. Does this mean trouble?? Cleaned radiator as good as possible at campground, on return home ambient temp low 80's and rain, running 65 mph temps much lower, water temp 195, engine oil 202, trans oil 180 degrees, but oil press lower too at 45. Think there is 15/40 Rotella in engine, maybe oil press goes up with temp? From records looks like only 1000 miles on two year old oil. What should I change it out to? Does the white cloud on start up mean T-R-O-U-B-L-E?? Had to spell it out instead of saying the word! Thanks, look fwd to reply.

[Neweller]

Q
782 9/17/2002 4:46:03 PM 9/18/2002 Bert Hunter coeinc@bellsouth.net Door Jaming I have a 1991 Coach. I have a question about two items that seem to give me fits on my coach!!! Can anyone help???
#1. When the right side of my coach sits in the sun too long my side entrance door jams and is almost impossible too open or close. It seems the door jam closes in on the door.
#2. When I back up my coach the front brakes grab and make the coach vibrate. I love my coach but these two things drive me crazy!!! Can someone help me with these questions???

[Neweller]

Q
783 9/17/2002 7:03:33 PM 9/18/2002 Tuga Gaidry tuga@cajun.net GPS Systems - Factory Installed If you are interested in a less expensive system, I suggest a laptop computer and Microsoft's Streets & Trips software. It can be purchased for about $40, and a GPS receiver can be attached. I use Streets & Trips software without the GPS because it has a feature which enables the user to type in your current location (ex. corner of 4th and Elm St, Billings, MT; hit enter and bam there you are!) Try it, you'll love it.

[Neweller]

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784 9/18/2002 8:14:19 AM 9/18/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com Overheating/engine smoke If the temperatures you are reporting are correct, the engine is running too hot. We suggest you have a mechanic check the temperature with a mechanical gauge at the engine. If you can confirm that the radiator is indeed clean (looking through the radiator with a mechanic's trouble light shining through from the other side is a good technique), inspect the radiator for other damage, such as broken or bent fins. We suspect you may ultimately determine that the radiator needs to be rebuilt or replaced. FYI - the Newell parts department stocks rebuilt radiators for 92 Series powered coaches. The cost of a rebuilt radiator approximately $2000 plus about $250 crating and freight. To confirm availability and price, call 1-888-3NEWELL and ask for Gary Streeter; have the physical dimensions of the radiator in your coach. Also, you indicate that you think the coach engine is operating with 15/40 Rotella. This is not a suitable engine lubricating oil. The ONLY multi-viscosity oil that has proven satisfactory for 92 Series Detroits is Mobil Delva 1, a synthetic that may not be cost justified for a ten year old coach. If you prefer a mineral base oil, we recommend a premium quality SAE 40 straight weight oil meeting API CH-4 service category. Talk with a Detroit technician about the white smoke on start-up.

[Neweller]

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785 9/18/2002 1:24:59 PM 9/19/2002 John Leuenberger jeleuen@attglobal.net Door Jaming Hi Burt, Had a similar problem with door on a
Barth. Both the sidewall and door expand in the sun due to heating up, so any gap between door and jamb is reduced accordingly. If sidewalls and door are a dark color it will soak up heat instead of reflecting it. Maybe some way to increase the gap on the side of the door but then you might need more weatherstripping in cold wx to seal the gap when everything contracts. Shading door with awning is passive no cost measure which might work sometimes. But more permanent and cost effective fix might be to reduce width of door by maybe eighth of inch. Good luck. John L

[Neweller]

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786 9/18/2002 9:43:43 PM 9/19/2002 John Clark jvclark02@cs.com GPS Systems - Factory Installed I use a Laptop mounted on a Jotto Desk which swivels between the coach commander and the driver. I use DeLorme Street Atlas USA with their tripmate GPS receiver, etc All the streets in the US and most points of interest are on one disk. It has trip routing and provides verbal instructions as you approach intersecting highways. It also has voice recognition and accepts commands such as, how far, how long until I get there, etc. Cost is $39 for Street Atlas and $120 for the GPS. They also sell a Topo program for $99 that contains all topo maps in the US along with 3D viewing of upcoming mountain passes, canyons along with downloadable satellite pictures. The system is very easy to use and works fantastic on the road. I love technology! I am sitting in an RV park in Ely Nevada using my laptop attached to my cell phone to write this E-mail.

[Neweller]

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788 9/19/2002 8:44:10 AM 9/19/2002 Dave Copeland d_copeland@msn.com GPS Systems - Factory Installed I have both a laptop system running DeLorme's street atlas and the Alpine DVD. As pointed out, the laptop package is much less expensive and has greater street detail, but if I had to choose between the 2 the Alpine is superior and worth the money for the following reason:
The display is designed for driving - it is easily readable as you drive andgives you the information that you need as you drive. If you are approaching a complex intersection it will indicate ahead of time the lane you should be in and give you a good pictorial description of the various lanes and ramps. It can be installed so that you can see it easily and is much less intrusive than a laptop. I can drive across country or through NYC and feel very compfortable with the Alpine system. It is one of my most favorite options on my Newell.

[Neweller]

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789 9/19/2002 12:30:41 PM 9/20/2002 Bill Sims BillSims@National-Insurance.Com Pre-Owned Newell Coach What a great suggestion from the staff. I have a 93 Newell and would only be selling or trading to get a newer model. This also might give the sales staff prospects for trade ins, rather that using a Wholesaler.

[Neweller]

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790 9/20/2002 5:09:17 AM 9/20/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com Door Jaming A quick way to free up a door jammed by the sun's heat: throw a glass of water anywhere on the joint between the door and the sidewall. Often, just a few ounces of water will free the door. The brakes are a tougher question. When the composition of brake linings is determined, a number of considerations come into play. If the linings are too hard, braking performance is lost and noise can be an issue. Linings that are too soft wear too quickly and can be too sensitive. In addition, brake linings can be properly balanced for performance during forward movement, but it is very common for heavy vehicles to have some brake noise and shudder in reverse. To further confuse the issue, different vehicles with the same brake and lining specifications can exhibit different noise characteristics. If you want to try to eliminate the noise and shudder, you might sand the linings or, if this doesn't work, reline the brakes.

[Neweller]

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791 9/23/2002 12:32:07 PM 9/28/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com Overheating/engine smoke After some further research, we learned that rebuilt radiators for 1982 models are not currently available. Another option if the radiator is in good enough condition, and probably less expensive, would be to have a radiator shop recore your unit. Finally, a new radiator is available on special order at a cost of $2380 plus packing and freight.