Tech Talk Archives 8

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807 10/3/2002 10:02:37 PM 10/4/2002 John Clark jvclark02@cs.com Overheating/engine smoke I can't speak for the Cat, but Detroit's finest kind of frown on 10-20 minute warm ups except for very cold conditions. Diesels, unlike gasoline engines, tend to run cool at idle and prolonged idling tends to dilute the oil. I know, you see truckers idling their engings all night, but the Detroit engine experts claim these guys are hurting their engines. They recommend a short warm up (2-5 minutes in normal outside temperatures) but avoiding full throttle operations until normal operating temperatures are reached. I highly recommend the use of a block heater for cold morning starts to avoid the prolonged warm up requirement. I know this goes against the 'old school' but so does riding the brakes down a steep hill.

[Neweller]

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808 10/6/2002 5:49:44 AM 10/6/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com Synthetic oil's in the 8V92 With one significant exception, Newell recommends that operators of Detroit Diesel engines follow Detroit's recommendations regarding lubricating oils for their various engine models. This document can be downloaded with Adobe Acrobat software at www.detroitdiesel.com/public/svc/lofindex.asp . The exception is that Newell has confirmed over long term oil sample testing that multi-grade Mobil Delvac 1 performs very well in Detroit's two-stroke engines (92 series). However, Mobil (and Detroit through a private labeled Mobil product) now offer a straight weight version of Mobil Delvac 1. At Newell, we still like the multi-grade Delvac 1 because of easier starting in cold weather, but be prepared to experience a lot of prejudice against use of a mulit-grade in a two-stroke Detroit. For a more complete discussion of this topic, go to the TechTalk board and do a "find" under subject "oil," or copy and paste the following URL: http://www.newellcoach.com:591/bboar...=Thread&-find=

[Neweller]

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809 10/9/2002 4:57:03 PM 10/10/2002 Dan Niebojeski bojes@aol.com odometer malfunction The odometer on my 2001 Newell will at times flash on and off and flash unreadable jiberish. Most of the time it works fine. I have checked for loose conections both at the speedometer head and at the box on the side of the engine. Also the hour meter in the tachometer will do the same thing, but only once in a while. Any ideas?

[Neweller]

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810 10/10/2002 12:05:11 PM 10/10/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com odometer malfunction This would most certainly appear to be an electrical anomaly of some sort. The problem is not at the data source, as the speedometer/odometer and the tach/hour meter have different sources (transmission computer and engine computer). We'd suggest that you observe for anything else occurring at the same time, such as voltmeter fluctuations, is generator always running or not, does anything else flicker, such as dash lights, etc. Like they say, "we've never seen this before." And in this case, true. This is going to take some detective work and possibly a little luck to diagnose.

[Neweller]

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812 10/13/2002 6:37:20 PM 10/26/2002 ken mccarlk@rogers.com rear suspention was wondering if anybody had thers rear suspention(bushings, centric cams, airbags, complete brakes, air lines and valves, bags and brakes)replaced , i was just given a estimate of 7000.00 to do the complete rear unit , the reason for the complete is the coach had a major fire in the engine , i dont want to give up on it,it is to nice of a coach to use for parts,its a 1984 40, can anybody give me any advice , to much or ?

[Neweller]

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813 10/16/2002 8:04:48 AM 10/26/2002 Bill Burch bmburch@swbell.net engine temperature The temperature gauge on my 95 model with a 60 Series never stabilizes. It goes to a little over 200 within 30 miles and then it constantly ranges from 210 to as low as 190. As soon as the fan kicks on the temperature drops. Is this normal? I run several diesel trucks and find their temperature to be constant which I assume is from the air flow. I've had the local Detroit shop check the engine analyzer to see if the problem may be in the gauge but their equipment shows the same readings.

[Neweller]

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814 10/20/2002 6:25:53 PM 10/26/2002 Kelly Scott kscott6264@netscape.net Electric Heaters 1980 Newell

2 of the electric heaters within our coach make "strange" noises, though still producing heat. I have elected to replace them.

I have found a unit made by QMARK in the Grainger book. This unit has the same specifications or measurements as the units I have in the coach. I have been unable to get a part number off of the unit installed in the coach. The voltage and heat output is as follows. 1500/750 Watts 120 volts BTU 5120/2560 . $140.10

All the above to ask one question: Will these units work in the coach, or does anyone have a better source, or suggestion?

Kelly Scott

[Neweller]

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815 10/21/2002 9:03:28 PM 10/26/2002 Terry Sparks terrysparks@elitewireline.com Engine Preference??? Would you choose the the 8V92 or the series 60 in a 95 model 45'coach matched with a HT741 4 speed tranny. What are the pro's & con's of these two engine's? How about the tranny? Any other input is welcome. This will be my First newell.

[Neweller]

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817 10/26/2002 7:18:49 PM 10/27/2002 Kelly Scott kscott6264@netscape.net Electric Heaters Everyone is correct, I found that the replacement heaters that they are replacing the original's with do have a slightly larger footprint. They do however appear to be of excellent quality, and cost $88.00 plus freight. Will do slight modification and use them front and rear, and bay.

The bathroom heater I will purchase from Grainger, the same footprint for $140.00 plus freight.

Thanks to everyone for your help in this matter, happy motoring.
Ks

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818 10/27/2002 9:28:31 AM 10/27/2002 John Clark jvclark02-nospam-@cs.com Engine Preference??? My vote is for the DD Series 60 hands down. The 8V92 is no longer available for highway use (circa early 90's) and parts and service are fast becoming an issue. The Series 60 is a much cleaner engine, provides better mileage, and developes higher torque at lower RPM's. Average TBO (time before overhaul) is 750,000 to 1 million miles for a series 60 versus 350,000 for an 8v92. I own an 8V92, and thoroughly enjoy it, but plan to upgrade when TBO is reached. FWIW, I think the ultimate combination is the Series 60 or Cat C12, teamed with an Allison six speed World transmission.

[Neweller]

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819 10/27/2002 9:45:54 AM 10/27/2002 John Clark jvclark02-nospam-@cs.com rear suspention When I hear the term "major fire", I always become concerned. I once owned a salvage auto business and found that high heat can do very interesting things to metal. IMHO you might consider having a structural engineer or really good welder/mechanic inspect it before putting a lot of money into non-structural components. I inspected a rear burned MCI 102 once and refused to appraise it due to numerous hairline cracks in the frame. Newell makes a fantastic coach and their frames are the best in the world, but I would still have the frame and major drive components inspected for structural integrity before investing big bucks in an older coach.

[Neweller]

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821 10/27/2002 4:00:07 PM 11/3/2002 Bob Marlatt InsideGolf@cablespeed.com Replacing the 391 engine with a 460 I have a 1973 coach in wonderful condition but have always been puzzled as to why it was fitted with an underpowered 391 when the 460 would have been the obvious choice. The question I have is: what problems am I in for if I decide to replace the 391 with a 460? Will it bolt up to the transmission or will I have to have a special adaptor plate made? What other concerns should I have? motor-mounts? driveline? rearend?

[Neweller]

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822 10/28/2002 6:02:40 PM 11/3/2002 Ann Haynes jdh1214@msn.com value of coach My husband and I are considering selling a 1970 Newell Coach. Does anyone know what it may be worth. I think it has about 89,000 miles, and it's in great condition. We would appreciate any help.... thanks! Ann

[Neweller]

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825 11/3/2002 3:10:54 PM 11/3/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com Replacing the 391 engine with a 460 In the late 1960s and early 1970s, Newell built gas powered coaches with several different engines. In addition to the 391 Ford Industrial V8, coaches were built with 460 Ford V8s, 534 Ford Industrial V8s (expect 4 to 5 mpg), as well as 440 Chrysler V8s. Allison, Ford, and Chrysler automatic transmissions were used. A repower that would upgrade from a 391 to any of the above would probably require upgrading the transmission, driveshaft, rear axle, and cooling system--major challenges with a considerable commitment of resources required. In other words, probably expensive, with the additional investment not adding much to the resale value. You might consider trading coaches to get the added power. A big jump in power and performance occurred in the late 1970s with the availability of 92 Series Detroit Diesel power.

[Neweller]

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826 11/4/2002 8:00:59 PM 11/5/2002 Linda Schneider ltschneider@earthlink.net value of coach We paid ~ 50K for a '79 Newell in 1999. It had been recently updated/refurbished to the tune of over 20K prior to our purchase and had around 90K miles on a Detroit 6V92 engine at time of purchase. Hope this is useful information.

Linda

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827 11/7/2002 6:44:33 PM 11/8/2002 CJ Thompson f350ct@aol.com NEWELL Coach Questions I have an opportunity to purchase a 1984 38' Newell Coach with just over 100K original miles. The unit is in good condition with only normal wear and tear for it's age. It is completly original having no updating to the interior or exterior. Being dated to its vintage, it is quite nice. The coach is powered by the CUMMINS engine- I believe it is the 855 which is rated at 350HP and the Allison 4 speed. My questions are:
1) is their any known problems which need to be addressed with this particluar engine and drive train?
2)is the unit able to accelerate and pull mountain grades relativly well - and stop too?
3) any structural or quality issues that i need to be watchful of?
4)I have no idea what the Coach is worth, nor does the owner who is just needing to dispose of the coach. I want to make a fair and reasonable offer to the seller. Their is virtually no data available as to what the fair market value of this coach is. Does anyone have any ball park figures?

Thank you!

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828 11/10/2002 6:57:57 AM 11/11/2002 ken mccarlk@rogers.com rear suspention Thanks John, we had the complete rear suspension out down to the frame, with engine and trans out, used a special powder and spray and found no cracks of any sort, Ken A
829 11/10/2002 7:01:06 AM 11/11/2002 ken mccarlk@rogers.com NEWELL Coach Questions I am no expert , but while rebuilding my 84 Newell 40 ft over the past year I have seen the market as low as $60,000 and as high as $120,000.00. I have seen all the the info on www. rvtraderonline.com

[Neweller]

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830 11/10/2002 5:56:26 PM 11/11/2002 Kelly Scott kscott6264@netscape.net Speedometer 1980 Newell. Speedometer quit on our trip to Branson MO. I would assume it is the cable? Does Newell still carry this cable? Is their some other component associated with the speedometer I should look into first? We have 156K miles on this speedometer.
Kelly Scott

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831 11/10/2002 6:13:37 PM 11/11/2002 Kelly Scott kscott6264@netscape.net Transmission Temp On pulling a long steep grade, what is the normal temperature for the transmission oil? The outside air temp was 50 degrees. Allison 4 speed, 1980 Newell coach. It was approaching 240 degrees. Is this normal?

Kelly Scott

[Neweller]

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832 11/11/2002 5:34:53 AM 11/11/2002 TechTalk Staff TechTalk@newellcoach.com Speedometer To see a previous message thread on this subject which addresses your question, click the "Find" icon in the left margin. In the Search for Messages screen, enter "Speedo Operation" on the subject line.