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05-22-2010, 01:40 AM
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#21
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: south louisiana
Posts: 654
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battery disposal
Hey, I know I am a slow reader but, I missed the comment about leaving old 8ds in my front yard.
But now that I do have a battery issue, I've started reading all the posts about Tom's starter (weight lifting) workout.
Great info but I can't even find the fuse spoke of? Do all coaches have them?
My coach has sealed starting batteries now, and I'm not sure how old they are. But they have gone down twice after sitting for 60 days each time.
I will replace. (cheapest?) I have never taken that approach!
I've always paid for what I got.
or
Got what I paid for!
Either way I always get it wrong.....
__________________
__________________
if you think my spellin is bad, you should sea my handwritten. #437 w/flex toad (STAY AWAY FROM LARRY BELL aka larrynjeri) he is a lier and a lock picker.
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05-22-2010, 04:08 AM
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#22
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Idyllwild, CA
Posts: 1,340
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Matt,
If you are coming to so cal still I can help you with you batteries...you will still have to lift them...I will just help you decide and watch you pay for them.
You Batteries may not be bad, something as simple as the stereo could draw the batteries down, it uses power to keep the memory of preset channels.
__________________
__________________
have Coach will Travel
Steve & Tricia
1982 Newell 38' (built before #1) 6V92 DD, 5 Speed Allison, 12.5 KW Kohler, Couch used to make into a Bed but I fixed it!
https://newellshowcase.com/thumbnails.php?album=214
2007 Yukon, 1981 CJ7 Laredo, 2002 Honda CRV, 1955 Thunderbird, 1952 Pontiac Sedan Delivery, 1952 Ford 8N, 1958 Airstream, 1959 Glasspar 16' Avalon, Cabin in the Woods........what will I work on next
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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05-22-2010, 12:15 PM
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#23
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Huntington WV
Posts: 1,041
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Matt,
Are you throwing the battery disconnect switch when you leave the coach. For the chassis batteries, it's in the stainless panel in the right rear bay with the batteries.
For the house batteries, it is located in the bay with the house batteries.
Neither of mine will stay charged for more than about three weeks IF I leave them connected because of parasitic loads. (like Steve said, clocks, and radios, and such)
I do not store my coach plugged in.
Some will probably chime in about using an echo charger if you do store plugged in.
__________________
Richard Rhonda Ty and Alex Entrekin
1995 Newell # 390 DD Series 60, Allison World Trans
Subaru Outback toad
CoMotion Tandem
Often wrong, but seldom in doubt
Rhonda's chronicle https://wersquared.wordpress.com/
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05-22-2010, 12:51 PM
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#24
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Houma, LA
Posts: 886
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Matt,
As we discussed yesterday, engine batteries usually last about 2 to 4 years. My guess is that yours are more than 2 years old. I would have a battery shop load test the batteries after you have recharged them. They probably need to be replaced. Give Newell a call and find out the cold cranking amps needed; I think it is about 1000 to 1100 CCA.
I installed a Power Pulse device on mine. It sends an electrical charge thru the batteries every few seconds and prevents sulfation from occuring. When sulfation occurs a build up of sulphur(I'm guessing here) attaches to the battery plates and this causes the battery to become less efficient. My batteries have lasted 4 years almost to the month that I first installed them. So I feel that I got double the normal life. Not bad for an $80 investment.
Google Power Pulse battery savers - it's a good investment. Newell Coach sells them also.
__________________
Tuga & Karen Gaidry
1999 Newell 45 w/2 slides
Coach #512
2005 Pilot
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05-22-2010, 01:21 PM
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#25
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,558
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If you are an electrical do-it-yourselfer, you might take a look at http://www.reuk.co.uk/Battery-Desulfation.htm this site for instructions on building your own battery desulfation device. Note the admonition that you should trickle charge the battery while using the device since the battery voltage will drop as the lead sulfate crystals are removed from the battery plates.
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05-22-2010, 04:29 PM
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#26
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: south louisiana
Posts: 654
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again, thanks for all the help and info. Richard, I don't disconnect anything. Thats most likely my problem.
I will pull the batteries and have them tested.
Thanks for all info.
But I am curious about the fuse Tom spoke of?
__________________
if you think my spellin is bad, you should sea my handwritten. #437 w/flex toad (STAY AWAY FROM LARRY BELL aka larrynjeri) he is a lier and a lock picker.
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05-22-2010, 04:31 PM
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#27
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Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 17
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Tuga, I have been using the power pulses for about 3 years before Newell started using them. Hang tight on your batteries because you should get 8 years or better with the power pulses.
I was at a Newell ralley in florida and another looked at my power pulesers and tipped off Newell who then started putting them in their coaches. I hope he got a bonus for the tip off to Newell.
Link to Powerpulse: <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004I6QREK/ref=as_li_qf_sp_asin_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative =9325&creativeASIN=B004I6QREK&linkCode=as2&tag=aff iliatechie-20">12 Volt Power Pulse Battery Charger</a><img src="http://www.assoc-amazon.com/e/ir?t=affiliatechie-20&l=as2&o=1&a=B004I6QREK" width="1" height="1" border="0" alt="" style="border:none !important; margin:0px !important;" />
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05-22-2010, 07:10 PM
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#28
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Huntington WV
Posts: 1,041
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Matt,
The fuse that Tom was referring to is actually on the ground cable. It's either a 50 or 70 amp job. It's purpose is to prevent you from having a dead short in the electrical system, or in Tom's case a locked starter because the engine is locked. I actually have two of them. One is in the main ground cable, and one is in the ground cable that is dedicated to the starter.
Your coach is very similar to mine. I can see the fuse from the batterys. It is black, about 1.5 inches in diameter and is an in line fuse with the main ground cable.
It is not a fuse in a fuse box anywhere. It is an in line fuse, in the ground cable.
Was that enough to confuse you?
__________________
Richard Rhonda Ty and Alex Entrekin
1995 Newell # 390 DD Series 60, Allison World Trans
Subaru Outback toad
CoMotion Tandem
Often wrong, but seldom in doubt
Rhonda's chronicle https://wersquared.wordpress.com/
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05-22-2010, 10:49 PM
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#29
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: south louisiana
Posts: 654
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Got It. I replaced batteries and all is well again
bought from batteries plus. Some reason previous owner used deep cycle freedom batteries.....
the guy at batteries plus sold me on cheaper wet with 1500-1700 cranking power.....
Thanks again to all......
Snowing in Reno now....
__________________
if you think my spellin is bad, you should sea my handwritten. #437 w/flex toad (STAY AWAY FROM LARRY BELL aka larrynjeri) he is a lier and a lock picker.
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05-22-2010, 11:25 PM
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#30
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Houma, LA
Posts: 886
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Matt,
I did the exact same thing; Batteries Plus had the best price on wet cell 8Ds with high cold cranking amps. Now you're set - no more worrying about the engine not cranking when you turn the key.
http://www.survivalunlimited.com/bat...werpulse12.htm
The Power Pulse is the best $68 you ever spend; it doubled the life of my starting batteries. Check it out!
__________________
Tuga & Karen Gaidry
1999 Newell 45 w/2 slides
Coach #512
2005 Pilot
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05-22-2010, 11:28 PM
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#31
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Houma, LA
Posts: 886
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wallyarntzen
Tuga, I have been using the power pulses for about 3 years before Newell started using them. Hang tight on your batteries because you should get 8 years or better with the power pulses.
I was at a Newell ralley in florida and another looked at my power pulesers and tipped off Newell who then started putting them in their coaches. I hope he got a bonus for the tip off to Newell.
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So you are the guy that Tommy Key told me about. He said that someone told them about Power Pulses at a rally. Small world isn't it - who would have thunk it!
Wally, you are the man!
__________________
Tuga & Karen Gaidry
1999 Newell 45 w/2 slides
Coach #512
2005 Pilot
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12-19-2011, 02:11 AM
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#32
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Muskogee, OK USA
Posts: 208
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Starting current?
I am having an issue with starting the coach with the starter batteries. I have installed new batteries (two 8D2, 1700 CCA each). the starter will engage and the engine will turn over a couple of times and that's it. I have removed and cleaned all the cables, and have checked the ground all the way from the negative post (fuse on negative post is good) to the block and to the starter with one to two ohms max. Batteries are charged and alternator is working fine. It will start when I use the merge switch. My question is how many amps will the starter draw on average, I know if the engine is really cold it could draw more current. Right now in 50 degree weather, the starter is pulling about 551 amps, not sure if this is high and I could have a starter going bad.
Jeff
__________________
Jeff and Pam
1996 Newell 45'/Tag
60 Series Detroit
Coach #432
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12-19-2011, 07:06 AM
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#33
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: mesa, az
Posts: 1,375
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hi jeff,
i went through a similar experience with my 1990 8v92. i replaced the batteries and made sure the alternator was working right and when i convinced myself the starter was drawing too much current (more than 551amps you are referring to) and still had the problem. it ended up being the fuse between the ground and the batteries. a big fuse.btw, 551amps i believe at peak under load i think is normal. but someone please verify that.
the reason merge works is that it us just using the house batteries.
not sure that helps, but thats what it was for me. btw, the starter on my 8v92 weighed 80pounds. after i put a new one in i found out that there is a geared starter for the same price that weighs less than half.
i know you have a series 60, but i think all of this still is similar.
tom
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12-19-2011, 11:05 AM
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#34
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Muskogee, OK USA
Posts: 208
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Starter
Thanks Tom,
Yes I read your post and could of wrote it word for word except the part with your daughter helping you. We drove to Mexico beach and back and everything was fine, 3 days later I went out to move the coach into our storage building and it would not even turn over. I flipped the merge switch and the starter solenoid would just click. I checked the starter batteries and they showed about 3/4 charged, house batteries were fine. I put the big charger on them and still nothing, it acted like the starter was hung up. I proceeded to remove the starter when the rain started. I had to get a 3 foot cheater just to get the bolts broke loose, by now the rain is running down the side of the coach pretty good and pouring on my backside and legs while I am hunkered over kneeling on top of the starter batteries. I finally get the beast off and take it into the shop, this is when I noticed the nut on the positive post of the starter solenoid which actually goes into the side of the starter was loose. I had not touched this nut during removal. I tightened the nut, hooked the starter to an old tweleve volt battery and it turned fine. At this point I wanted to cry thinking WHY did I not check this when it was still attached tot the engine, I was soaking wet and thought I had just removed this thing for nothing. I went back out in the rain and installed the starter back. I tried to start the coach, it would turn over, but not very fast. I hooked up the big charger (thinking I had drained the batteries while attempting to start the coach earlier. After five minutes of charging, the coach started and I moved it into the building out of the rain. Since that time, I have replaced both starter batteries, cleaned all the cables, verified a good ground, verified the batteries are getting charged from both the on board charger and the alternator. The coach will start just fine when merged with the house batteries, the starter batteries alone will not start the coach. Sunday morning I read your post about the fuse and again thought (crap), I went out and checked it too make sure that was not the problem, it checked good. We started the coach (with the merge on) drove 20 miles, engine up to 180 degrees. I shut off the coach and it restarted fine with just the starter batteries. It started twice and that was it, the starter batteries did not have enough power to start it a third time. Flipped the merge switch and it started fine. This is what had led me to believe the starter was pulling two much current and knocking the starter batteries to their knees.
Jeff
__________________
Jeff and Pam
1996 Newell 45'/Tag
60 Series Detroit
Coach #432
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12-19-2011, 01:31 PM
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#35
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Idyllwild, CA
Posts: 1,340
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Jeff,
Use a Volt Meter so that you can see what the voltage is at the starter, put the leads at the same terminals that the starter gets it power from (+) at the positive cable connection (like you stated with a loose nut on a terminal) and (-) at the negative cable connection. Now go back through the tests using the engine batteries and the merge function.
So many times it is simply a loose connection and mostly a loose ground (-). Not sure about your engine but my 6V92 requires 2000 cranking amps and that is why there are two 8D batteries.
Good luck, I know that it can be frustrating, just write down the findings while performing the tests with the volt meter and test the voltage at numerous points of the positive (+) and negative (-) cables one cable at a time.
__________________
have Coach will Travel
Steve & Tricia
1982 Newell 38' (built before #1) 6V92 DD, 5 Speed Allison, 12.5 KW Kohler, Couch used to make into a Bed but I fixed it!
https://newellshowcase.com/thumbnails.php?album=214
2007 Yukon, 1981 CJ7 Laredo, 2002 Honda CRV, 1955 Thunderbird, 1952 Pontiac Sedan Delivery, 1952 Ford 8N, 1958 Airstream, 1959 Glasspar 16' Avalon, Cabin in the Woods........what will I work on next
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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12-19-2011, 06:03 PM
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#36
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: mesa, az
Posts: 1,375
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hi jeff, i sent you an email with my phone number. give me a call if you want to chat about it.
tom
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12-19-2011, 09:11 PM
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#37
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Georgia
Posts: 35
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Jeff,
I would put a full charge on the batteries and then load test, just to rule that out.
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12-21-2011, 02:01 AM
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#38
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Muskogee, OK USA
Posts: 208
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Coach now Starting
I want to thank everyone for the replies and the offers to help. I spoke with Tom and Richard tonight and after going over everything that I had done, they asked me to take a few more checks with my volt meter and record my readings. As I was trying to get a good spot on the negative post of the starter, I noticed the negative cable coming from the starter batteries laying right underneath the negative post of the stater. I guess in my hast to re-install the starter the other day, I hooked the braided cable from the engine block, but failed to hook up the negative cable coming from the batteries. I hooked this cable up and the starter spun like a top and the engine started right up. I am assuming my original problem was the loose nut on the positive terminal on the starter solenoid to the starter. When I re-installed the starter and inadvertently left the negative cable off the negative post on the back of the starter, is what caused the rest of my problems. Though I am embarrassed by making such a silly mistake, I am happy the starter is fine and everything seems to working well now.
Thanks again
Jeff
__________________
Jeff and Pam
1996 Newell 45'/Tag
60 Series Detroit
Coach #432
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12-21-2011, 02:50 AM
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#39
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Riverside, California
Posts: 1,543
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It is often something that simple Jeff. Congratulations on solving the problem!
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12-21-2011, 03:15 AM
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#40
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Thibodaux, LA
Posts: 1,221
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Hey Jeff you're now part of the coveted inner circle!
__________________
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